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Author Topic: The Worst Wheel State  (Read 3569 times)

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Reyth

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The Worst Wheel State
« on: August 07, 2016, 05:08:09 AM »
Here is a dump of the worst wheel state I have seen so far:

Code: [Select]
0 -- 32  39  108
 1 -- 41  64  92  93  100
 2 -- 10  86  97
 3 -- 6  26  27  33  88
 4 -- 8
 5 -- 60
 6 -- 58
 7 -- 14  42
 8 -- 24  31  34  96
 9 -- 46  50  72  80  89  110
 10 -- 70
 11 -- 7  9  91  113
 12 -- 16  29  102
 13 -- 2  11
 14 -- 1  57  66
 15 -- 18  47
 16 -- 30  38  69
 17 -- 63  67
 18 -- 49  104  109
 19 -- 13  22  94  101  112
 20 -- 54  73
 21 -- 17  52  81  106
 22 -- 15  56  61  87  111
 23 -- 37  40  48
 24 -- 19  20  23  59  75  95  98
 25 -- 36  68  84  103  105
 26 -- 62  65  71
 27 -- 3  35  51  77
 28 --
 29 -- 5  76  79  83
 30 -- 4  21  114 *
 31 -- 78
 32 -- 53  74  82  99  115
 33 -- 25
 34 -- 43  44  55  85
 35 -- 45  90  107
 36 -- 12  28

The last 37 numbers are:

29 9 21 32 29 25 34 2 22 3 9 35 11 1 1 19 24 8 2 24 32 1 19 12 25 18 25 21 35 0 18 9 22 19 11 30 32

There are only 6 unique numbers and 31 repeaters!  This leaves a massive section of the wheel unhit and a large amount of numbers outside of expectation.  This sort of wheel state is where we see our systems massively failing with results that seem to defy the odds. 

Can we get lucky and have our selection be one of the repeaters?  Of course but the chances are greater for the opposite to take place.  This wheel state can persist for spin after spin as well...

None of us should want to bet in this environment unless we are specifically targeting repeaters.
« Last Edit: August 07, 2016, 05:28:16 AM by Reyth »


 
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MrPerfect.

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Re: The Worst Wheel State
« Reply #1 on: August 07, 2016, 10:45:47 AM »
Here is a dump of the worst wheel state I have seen so far:

Code: [Select]
0 -- 32  39  108
 1 -- 41  64  92  93  100
 2 -- 10  86  97
 3 -- 6  26  27  33  88
 4 -- 8
 5 -- 60
 6 -- 58
 7 -- 14  42
 8 -- 24  31  34  96
 9 -- 46  50  72  80  89  110
 10 -- 70
 11 -- 7  9  91  113
 12 -- 16  29  102
 13 -- 2  11
 14 -- 1  57  66
 15 -- 18  47
 16 -- 30  38  69
 17 -- 63  67
 18 -- 49  104  109
 19 -- 13  22  94  101  112
 20 -- 54  73
 21 -- 17  52  81  106
 22 -- 15  56  61  87  111
 23 -- 37  40  48
 24 -- 19  20  23  59  75  95  98
 25 -- 36  68  84  103  105
 26 -- 62  65  71
 27 -- 3  35  51  77
 28 --
 29 -- 5  76  79  83
 30 -- 4  21  114 *
 31 -- 78
 32 -- 53  74  82  99  115
 33 -- 25
 34 -- 43  44  55  85
 35 -- 45  90  107
 36 -- 12  28

The last 37 numbers are:

29 9 21 32 29 25 34 2 22 3 9 35 11 1 1 19 24 8 2 24 32 1 19 12 25 18 25 21 35 0 18 9 22 19 11 30 32

There are only 6 unique numbers and 31 repeaters!  This leaves a massive section of the wheel unhit and a large amount of numbers outside of expectation.  This sort of wheel state is where we see our systems massively failing with results that seem to defy the odds. 

Can we get lucky and have our selection be one of the repeaters?  Of course but the chances are greater for the opposite to take place.  This wheel state can persist for spin after spin as well...

None of us should want to bet in this environment unless we are specifically targeting repeaters.
Why wouldn't you tell me more about this wheel?
 Please name following... make ( who made it), does it spin one or both directions? Wich ball type is in use? If you are not sure about the ball just say big or small and how jumpy, color... is it European wheel? And final,  would you like to track it for a while? It may happen that you gonna call this wheel " best of your life".
 

Reyth

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Re: The Worst Wheel State
« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2016, 11:53:29 AM »
Good point Mr. P.

You will be disappointed to know that this a high quality RNG wheel from a trusted source.  I would agree with you that physical wheels cannot be perfect in their random number generation due to the imperfect physical medium.

This is why I like RNG wheels because I don't need to worry about physical imperfections.  I can approach the random sequences themselves, observing their patterns and trends and acting accordingly.

We are approaching things entirely differently (different causes) but I can see how we could be doing so in the same way; i.e. seeking reliable patterns. ;)
 

MrPerfect.

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Re: The Worst Wheel State
« Reply #3 on: August 07, 2016, 03:17:52 PM »
Trused sorce is interesting. Problem with rng is that they are pseudo.  Imposible to create one wich not follow some patterns. If rng doesn't play egeinst player on purpose, l know how beat them.... well some of them.
 In the past l used to beat rng of bookmekker slots. These you can find in landbrooks and coral betting shops. Still have tools left from that time.
 If you would like to collect some data , l could run it thru my tools.
 Collect 300-400 spins to have a preliminary look, if you wish.
 
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Jesper

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Re: The Worst Wheel State
« Reply #4 on: August 07, 2016, 03:38:40 PM »
Trused sorce is interesting. Problem with rng is that they are pseudo.  Imposible to create one wich not follow some patterns. If rng doesn't play egeinst player on purpose, l know how beat them.... well some of them.
 In the past l used to beat rng of bookmekker slots. These you can find in landbrooks and coral betting shops. Still have tools left from that time.
 If you would like to collect some data , l could run it thru my tools.
 Collect 300-400 spins to have a preliminary look, if you wish.

No all kinds of RNG is not pseudo. There are TRNG which most casinos use, but not excel the tester.
 

Reyth

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Re: The Worst Wheel State
« Reply #5 on: August 07, 2016, 06:26:09 PM »
In this case the source agrees with you that true random doesn't exist but they have stated that they try their best to get there:

Quote
Hello,

This information is only accessible for the developers and it something that we do not share with the players. We take every effort to ensure that our results are as random as possible, and at times do see if we can update the random generator as we understand that truly random does not exist.
 

MrPerfect.

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Re: The Worst Wheel State
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2016, 07:04:01 PM »
In this case the source agrees with you that true random doesn't exist but they have stated that they try their best to get there:

Quote
Hello,

This information is only accessible for the developers and it something that we do not share with the players. We take every effort to ensure that our results are as random as possible, and at times do see if we can update the random generator as we understand that truly random does not exist.
just think what it really mean.... they update... it's not about being random, but exploitable.
 

Reyth

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Re: The Worst Wheel State
« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2016, 09:20:47 PM »
LOL.  Yes I think you are right! XD

One good thing though, this one isn't like games.com where it feeds you wins based on what you bet; I have been slammed whey too many times to count and lost millions of units repeatedly.
 

MrPerfect.

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Re: The Worst Wheel State
« Reply #8 on: August 07, 2016, 10:59:49 PM »
LOL.  Yes I think you are right! XD

One good thing though, this one isn't like games.com where it feeds you wins based on what you bet; I have been slammed whey too many times to count and lost millions of units repeatedly.
before this " war" between b&m casinos and betting shops, l were doing good money on coral " 20p roulette" , " classic roulette" and " keybet roulette". After the war was launched, software got updated..   it wasn't that " fair" anymore. That's exactly what made me to focus entirely on physical roulette devices....
 Damn slots started to play egeinst the player without making any exuses about it.
« Last Edit: August 07, 2016, 11:04:01 PM by MrPerfect. »
 
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Reyth

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Re: The Worst Wheel State
« Reply #9 on: August 08, 2016, 02:16:02 AM »

Here is another one with only 6 uniques, 8,17,18,28,33,36.  This one has 19 repeaters where the 0, 15 & 29 repeat 2 times each and 13 with 21 repeat a whopping 3 times!  That's almost the full third with only 5 numbers!!!  The equivalent of half the board has disappeared!!!!


Doesn't this all look familiar though?  Haven't we all seen these weird things as our systems bomb before our eyes?

Fortunately for me, I had chosen not to bet here but only spin through... :D
« Last Edit: August 08, 2016, 02:45:50 AM by Reyth »
 

Jesper

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Re: The Worst Wheel State
« Reply #10 on: August 08, 2016, 03:24:49 AM »
Do enough spins, and you will see all kinds. Remember the probability of the sequence 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10, is the same as 1,23,12,16,33,5,17,22,9,12. And the same goes for 13,13,13,13,13,13,13,13,13,13.   Some may think the last has never been shown, and it may be so for the second last as well.

A computer test of a large sample will confirm it. Use random org or an other quality generator.
 

Reyth

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Re: The Worst Wheel State
« Reply #11 on: August 08, 2016, 03:44:46 AM »
Well Jesper I must disagree.  Yes your second sequence is UNIQUE and thus very extremely rare BUT EVEN MORE RARE is a random sequence EXECUTING THE SAME NUMBER TEN TIMES IN A ROW CONSECUTIVELY.  Your third sequence stacks very extremely rare on top of extremely much even more rare (exponentially) than that which I think everyone in this forum will be dead without ever seeing it.

The worst odds in roulette will always be a back to back repeater, true random assumed.  We must not buy into the "expert's fallacy" when they so intently tell us that every number has the same odds every spin because they are only telling a half-truth and like I have always said, you cannot properly analyze an event without taking into account the circumstances surrounding that event.  They have a personal agenda which I am sick and tired of trying to fully figure out.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2016, 04:01:56 AM by Reyth »
 
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Jesper

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Re: The Worst Wheel State
« Reply #12 on: August 08, 2016, 05:30:53 AM »
Well Jesper I must disagree.  Yes your second sequence is UNIQUE and thus very extremely rare BUT EVEN MORE RARE is a random sequence EXECUTING THE SAME NUMBER TEN TIMES IN A ROW CONSECUTIVELY.  Your third sequence stacks very extremely rare on top of extremely much even more rare (exponentially) than that which I think everyone in this forum will be dead without ever seeing it.

The worst odds in roulette will always be a back to back repeater, true random assumed.  We must not buy into the "expert's fallacy" when they so intently tell us that every number has the same odds every spin because they are only telling a half-truth and like I have always said, you cannot properly analyze an event without taking into account the circumstances surrounding that event.  They have a personal agenda which I am sick and tired of trying to fully figure out.

Set one computer at work, see how many spins it will go until you see the first ten numbers you get will repeat.
It is a good chance you will never see it.  The same is when Dobbel says we can as well bet against the last ten, instead of waiting for a run (he is right).
 
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Reyth

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Re: The Worst Wheel State
« Reply #13 on: August 08, 2016, 08:27:54 AM »
I have run the last 10 simulation and I know the odds of it.
 

Avalon

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Re: The Worst Wheel State
« Reply #14 on: August 08, 2016, 01:17:05 PM »
Here is another one with only 6 uniques, 8,17,18,28,33,36.  This one has 19 repeaters where the 0, 15 & 29 repeat 2 times each and 13 with 21 repeat a whopping 3 times!  That's almost the full third with only 5 numbers!!!  The equivalent of half the board has disappeared!!!!
The pic is not visible.
Anyways, repeaters is the best way to go.............. from the little study I have done