Author Topic: Building a system on finals.  (Read 2460 times)

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MickyP

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Building a system on finals.
« on: January 06, 2018, 11:18:56 AM »
The ten finals group of numbers are:

0, 10, 20, 30.
1, 11, 21, 31.
2, 12, 22, 32.
3, 13, 23, 33.
4, 14, 24, 34.
5, 15, 25, 35.
6, 16, 26, 36.
7, 17, 27.
8, 18, 28.
9, 19, 29.

The numbers in the groups tend to follow each other in a random yet frequent manner. Systems have been developed around this concept so I have no claims on this except for my enthusiasm at developing a sound system based on these number groups.

Palestis, you created a working system based on a 38 spin cycle where the finals are recorded and the least hit finals are bet (up to four finals). I ran a few short tests and was surprised by the positive outcome.

Kav suggested playing only one final (3 or 4 numbers). Reyth also showed interest in betting few numbers. This would be flat betting. I second this viewpoint. Play few numbers flat betting if possible. If a progression is at all used, it must be a very soft one.

I have taken a list of about 150 numbers; I know it's too short to come to any conclusions but never-the-less I had to start looking at this to see if I can find some way of playing an active rewarding game. The numbers are divided into 18 number lotts. The first 18 numbers are used to track and establish your game. An X is placed next to each final that hits and the finals with the most hits are played for 18 spins. One or two finals is perfect but three is also okay.  The one test I did showed zero and six as dominant and in the 18 spins I had ten hits.

I know this doesn't prove too much but playing on single numbers with a 35-1 return and only playing a few numbers is worth the effort.

Another approach I tried was to take the two most recent finals and play them for 12 spins or a win whichever is first. My average win rate was 7 games out of 38 spins. I tried with three and four finals but I'm not crazy about betting too many numbers with a progression.

I must state that I have faith in Palestis and knowing that he has experience with finals including his own system tells me that I am on the right track. Thank you Palestis.

I look forward to your input.

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MickyP

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Re: Building a system on finals.
« Reply #1 on: January 06, 2018, 12:06:03 PM »
[size=0px]- A fact about finals is that 4 finals cannot go missing for more than 24 spins (that's the rare max).[/size][/size][size=0px]- 3 finals cannot go missing for more than 36 spins except 7-8-9 (9 numbers), that can go up to 40 spins missing (again that's the rarest limit). - Another fact is that when 4 finals can be combined in  quads, it is more likely that when one appears it will be in a quad rather than a split.    Example 5-8-6-9It forms 2 quads ( 5869-- and 25-26-28-29) and 15/18, 16/19 and 35/36 splits. You have to expect to hit the 2 quads more often than the 3 splits. You may play only the quads  to save chips. In the long run you will be ahead. I personally love the 7-8-9 finals because they are only 9 numbers and most of them  can be combined.  Like street 7-8-9, 17/18  split and 28/29  split.  Also the 0-7-8-9 are great because all of them are concentrated in 3 DS's: 7/12, 16/21 and 25/30.

A quote from Palestis above .

Maybe due to statistics the most hit in 18 spins operate on the LoTT so playing the most hit has merit.[/size]

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MickyP

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Re: Building a system on finals.
« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2018, 08:08:56 PM »
Did some more testing and must say Palestis is on the mark but my method preformed very well as well.

I record 38 spins and select the two weakest showing finals. I then bet the finals for the next 38 spins and have found that the first 18 bets produce the most wins (average 8 wins in 18 spins). The wins slow down in the second 18 numbers.

On my method of betting the two recent finals I get hits within 9 spins but there are times  when I have gone to 12-15 spins without a hit. By creating a threshold of 12 spins to stop, I am able to contain the game and recover the losses with ease.

I will really appreciate assistance in testing this further. If anyone has the time and inclination then please let me know.

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Scarface

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Re: Building a system on finals.
« Reply #3 on: January 07, 2018, 05:46:45 AM »
I use to play finals alot.  Start off with the last final that repeated.  For example, if the last few numbers hit were 7, 13, 8, 12, 19, 3 (most recent on the right).... I would play the 3 finals until a hit up to 9 spins.  If no hit in 9 spins, play the the most recent final that repeated.  Has a great success rate, and not bad to use a progression with

If there are 4 numbers in the final, play 9 spins.  If 3 numbers, play 12 spins, if 5 numbers play 7 spins.  If you are playing 3, 13, 23, 33 for 9 spins and dont get a hit play the next most recent repeated final.  Raise bet to 2 units.  If its 7, then play 7,17,27 for 12 spins.  Raise bet on eah series loss.  Ive never seen more than 4 series lost before 2 numbers are hit in a series
« Last Edit: January 07, 2018, 05:55:21 AM by Scarface »

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palestis

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Re: Building a system on finals.
« Reply #4 on: January 07, 2018, 06:02:20 AM »
Yes that's another good system playing only 1 final at a time. As long as you limit the chasing to a few spins. 9 sounds fine, but if you start another repeated final and wins soon enough to make a profit then you should abandon and start all over again with 1 final. That way you don't get carried away with playing too many numbers.

@Mickey.
So that I understand,  is this how you suggest playing your version of the finals system?
Take 18 numbers and play the 2 most frequently appeared finals?
In the pic the 1's and 6's are clearly ahead. And sure enough with 26 and 36 coming very soon it made an impressive profit.
Is it how you play it? and do you continue after a profit or look for new frequent finals and start another session?
« Last Edit: January 07, 2018, 06:05:54 AM by palestis »

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MickyP

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Re: Building a system on finals.
« Reply #5 on: January 07, 2018, 07:50:16 AM »
Thanks for the input. There are two ways I've been testing the finals approach.

First approach:  straight off the bat, select and play the two most recent finals to appear and play for 12 spins or a hit whichever is sooner. With a hit or 12 spins past immediately begin playing the first number to land and include the second on the next spin. Repeat the process until a hit or 12 spins without a hit then start fresh with new finals. The session length is 38 spins plus minus.

Second approach:  (this is the method you are interested in Palestis) . Record 18 spins marking what final they belong to from zero to nine. Select the two most hit finals and play them for the next 18 spins giving you a session total of 36 spins (18 used to track and 18 for play). With this method and the limited tests I've done the hit rate is pleasingly high. Playing until your first hit will turn this into a grind and you will miss out on many hits. My tests show that after 18 spins of play the two "hot" finals slow down. Nothing is set in stone at this time and the suggestions of limited spins per play is designed for a single hit eg; play a 4 number final for 9 spins. Playing 2 finals for 18 spins after tracking produces a lot of wins. These numbers can be changed to optimise potential hit rate.

The reason why I have selected two finals to play as opposed to one is because although both produce hits, one of them dominates the spin cycle. There is enough meat on the payout to play two finals without stress.

As stated, finals are nothing new but with a good method of play you will be able to have short exciting games with great rewards, hit and run if you like.

I am still to work out the progression, bankroll requirements and so on. The two methods above are wannabe methods/systems at this time . Much more testing is required.

Scarface

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Re: Building a system on finals.
« Reply #6 on: January 07, 2018, 04:54:39 PM »
Yes that's another good system playing only 1 final at a time. As long as you limit the chasing to a few spins. 9 sounds fine, but if you start another repeated final and wins soon enough to make a profit then you should abandon and start all over again with 1 final. That way you don't get carried away with playing too many numbers.

Yes, my explanation was probably confusing, but I only play 1 finale at a time.  If no hit in 9 spins, I switch to another one

MickyP

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Re: Building a system on finals.
« Reply #7 on: January 07, 2018, 07:07:37 PM »
Scarface, thanks so much for your contribution. I clearly understood your method of play and do not doubt the success it can achieve.

I'm looking at approaching this from a different angle that may bring to light a new finals method of play. What's running through my mind while I consume myself with tests is as follows:
1. Short exposure of bankroll chips on the table
2. A few numbers bet for a limited number of spins.
3. The best way to qualify the bet selection.
4. The use of a soft progression, flat betting or both.
5. How to proceed after the first hit?
6. Building a Stop Loss into the game by limiting playable spins in a session.
7. Finding trends that may produce faster wins.
8. A safe bankroll to cover at least three sessions a day.
9. Thoughts on how best to recover from a lost session.
10.qualifying a table before play.
11. Effect that croupier changes will have on a running game.
12. Keeping the play easy, simple and manageable.
13. Will I be able to effectively use the LoTT to benefit the system.

There are so many things to consider and get clarity on. That is why I opened this system discussion on the forum so that anyone interested in giving their two cents worth may do so. After all, is this not what the forum was designed for?

I do apologise for not responding to your post; it was not intentional.

Scarface

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Re: Building a system on finals.
« Reply #8 on: January 07, 2018, 07:21:26 PM »
Mickey, Finals are one of the first systems I played.  And I still go back to it sometimes.  I'll keep an eye on this thread and test to see what I can contribute.  My only suggestion is to never play cold number finals, only hotties

MickyP

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Re: Building a system on finals.
« Reply #9 on: January 07, 2018, 08:37:10 PM »
Thanks Scarface.

My tests are so revealing at this point that I have to abandon the method of tracking 18 and playing the hottest for the next 18 spins.
The hits do not justify the tracking period and tests reveal twists in the game where the hottest will become cold in the 18 spins. What to do about the hottest when they are hot? Here is what I'm looking at now...

I've noticed that finals cluster together in a few spins. When recording the 18 spins, not all the finals will appear. There will be one or two that will be a complete no show and three or four will have one or two hits. I see strong repeats in three sometimes four of the finals and I want to cash in on those trends but as quickly as they appear, so too do they disappear.

Looking at how the finals fall over 18/36 spins;  playing one final when it repeats is more of a psychological pacifier even if you only play it for nine spins. For this reason my choice of playing two finals for a limited number of spins is justified because the odds of the two selected finals not showing in nine spins is slim. I do all my tests manually so it's a bit of a grind but worth every moment. We tend to think we know everything about the game until we put pen to paper and study the different aspects of the game.

The one method that has stood it's ground in my tests is as follows:

No tracking required but you must record your game so you do not loose track of where you are. Table distractions can be a bitch!
The first spin reveals your first final. Play it. The second spin reveals your second final (you may have a hit from your first bet so no opportunity is wasted). Play the two finals for eight spins or until a win. Start over again. Here are 38 numbers I tested as an example:

27-first final.
35-second final
19
2
1
8
1
27-Hit
27- first final
34- second final
7- Hit
9 - first final
5 - second final
2
32
3
34
5- Hit
17 - first final
16 - second final
16- Hit
31 - first final
3 - second final
32
32
21 - Hit
0 - first final
16 - second final
32
6 - Hit
27 - first final
35 - second final
22
7 - Hit
30 - first final
28 - second final
2
28 - Hit.

The hit rate above shows as a good example of the tests I've been conducting. This is only the beginning as the system has to be packaged with all other aspects taken into account. All this and much more testing is required before I will consider it a playable system.

MickyP

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Re: Building a system on finals.
« Reply #10 on: January 07, 2018, 09:01:34 PM »
An example of first hit and no hit.

27 - first final
17 - Hit
1 - first final
30 - second final
21 - Hit
34 - first final
31 - second final
16
9
29
27
23
9
30
5 - stop play - No Hit.
35 - first final
36 - second final
28
3
0
26 - Hit.

MickyP

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Re: Building a system on finals.
« Reply #11 on: January 07, 2018, 09:24:12 PM »
I have just completed a 300 spin test:

Wins =50 games.
Loss = 6 games.

palestis

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Re: Building a system on finals.
« Reply #12 on: January 08, 2018, 12:21:44 AM »
The problem with the hot finals in 18 spins is that you have to take a look at other spins previously  to the 18 spins being tracked.
Because if the hot finals in the 18 spins  were also hot in the previous spins they may become colder in the 18 playable spins.
Also it's a good idea to have a god mix of the finals,  instead of one number appearing repeatedly.
If 14 appears many times it doesn't necessarily mean that the 4's are hot. it's much better if 24 and 34 add to the count, instead of just one number or two with the same final.
One thing is for sure.  If 3 or 4 finals are cold,  in 38 spins, when most of them appear, 2 of them will become hot.
Also you will find that when most of the cold finals appear, whenever one of them reappears it will usually drag another one from the group, is a few spins.
At some point the previously cold finals that started to appear, they will usually group together. Not all of them . But at least 2 of the 4.
I am sure you noticed that already.
Look at the example in the pic.
After marking the first 38 numbers, 0-2-3-5-7 seem to be colder.
But notice that most of them are appearing as group where there is a blue check mark.
Often times 5 times in a row.
Whether you chose to play all 5 finals or 2 or 3 of them in any grouping, they all appear close to the other. And that goes for many spins to come.
I am sure you would've made a profit in this table, regardless of how many of those 5 finals you played. Then you can start the process again.

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MickyP

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Re: Building a system on finals.
« Reply #13 on: January 08, 2018, 09:20:07 AM »
I see your reasoning regarding hot finals in 18 spins and the need to look at the previous 18 spins to establish what trend exists. Your screen shot clarifies this very well.
The more finals you play per spin, the more hits you are likely to have but I'd like to keep the bets down to two finals max. That's 6, 7 or 8 numbers at a time. Add a progression to that and you will require a fairly large bankroll to safely play a few sessions.

As an exercise I've taken the numbers from your screen shot starting from the left top to bottom and played with two finals running through 76 spins. The tally is 11 wins and 3 losses. No back to back losses recorded. If you like I will tabulate the exercise for you.

What I need to look at is the average win loss ratio on this method to determine if it's worth playing this way.

Jesper

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Re: Building a system on finals.
« Reply #14 on: January 08, 2018, 01:15:05 PM »
I do not get what you are after (Win I grasp) but in what case will finals be an advantages?  Only if you find a wheel, deep in the forest, which has no maintenance for years it may do, They rob you on your way home.
You can build it, you can win, but just you are lucky.